All Things ARK + Requests

I assume they have ARKK as an ETF too? But should only be available to US customers?

@iStocksTrader mentioned they are European so I’m still not sure how they got that non-CFD version.

I don’t have an account to test myself.

An account with eToro UK is not available to US citizens. A US person could signup with eToro US and access ARKK, but I expect the US person would not be allowed to be living outside the US. US expats have limited choices for investing and as far as I know they have no legal options for fee-free, low fx cost, low deposit/withdrawal cost sharing dealing in fractional shares. To use Robinhood, for example, would require a VPN to make Robinhood think you were in the US.

eToro UK says

4.5 We will not accept applications for eToro accounts from residents domiciled in Canada, or residents or citizens of the United States of America.

A similar restriction is imposed by Trading 212, Revolut, Freetrade, AJ Bell.

What I’m saying is under the eToro UK account, if you search ARKK is it giving you both a normal ETF and CFD version.

I assume it would just give the CFD version.

But what I still don’t understand is that @iStocksTrader who I assume has a UK/Euro account screengrab the order page which says that they would own the underlying asset.

So either they have a non-CFD version listed or they clicked on the CFD version and the dialog box has an incorrect legally dodgy sentence.

When I search on eToro I find only the CFD. There is no ordinary ETF that comes up in search. Perhaps people who they class as professional investors can see the ETF. But being so classified is supposed to be difficult.

No, my account is under european law, CySEC not UK!

Looking now at live (non-delayed) buy prices for ARKK quoted on eToro and the website of Merrill Lynch, US - the eToro buy price for their CFD appears to be consistently $0.30-$0.40 higher than the ETF share price on Merrill Lynch. Although the eToro page says priced provided by Nasdaq. I cannot see any quote for a sell price.

It is surprising that eToro mixes CFDs and shares on the same trading platform, rather than segregating them as Trading 212 and IG do.

Follow ark invest on Facebook and comment on this post so they know we want a European version https://www.facebook.com/1387354158152026/posts/2596597093894387/?d=n

They added three ARK funds (ARKK, ARKW and ARKF) 8 days ago. A week ago, I was able to buy into all three, owning the underlying asset. But this week when checking, only the CFDs are available. Possibly a misshap on their side?

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Yes. It looks like eToro made a mistake and then invented these CFDs to correct it.

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To be noted, when they had to remove all their non EU-compliant ETFs, and offer them as CFDs instead, the email specified that CFDs would be subject to normal CFDs’ nightly fees ; but any CFD ETF appears to be ā€œwithout feesā€ before buying into them, appart from the price markup.

I’ll update in a few days if i was charged any fee on the CFD, but it would appear not for the moment. Would make sense that there isn’t any nightly fee given that there isn’t any leverage, only a few cents on buy/sell spread.

You also cannot short the ETFs.

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So yeah I think they ballsd that up.

They probably shouldn’t be offering CFDs as a loophole. I’m not sure what the rules are on taking something not eligible and making it a CFD

Well I think as long as it isn’t crypto derivatives, anything can be a CFD 🤷
The addition of ARK funds were part of more than a hundred new addition, most of which being CFDs of non-EU products

Edit: ā€œmost of whichā€ is misleading. 33/109 to be correct.

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About the myth of the ARK ETFs not being allowed in Europe:

In Saxo Bank white label platform solutions used by some European banks , the investors could buy the ARK ETFs:

I know that some Portuguese banks :portugal: that use the Saxo Bank platform have the ARK ETFs:

  • Banco Best
  • Banco BiG
  • Banco Carregosa (GoBulling)
  • Banco Invest

Also ARK ETFs present in Spanish banks :es::

  • Inversis

In common in these banks, is that they are banks specialized in investments. Perhaps more European banks have these ARK ETFs, if you search for them.

I also found the KID for ARK ETFs.

It would be nice to know the @Team212 position on the ARK ETFs availability.

A Portuguese KID (Documento de InformaƧƵes Fundamentais ao Investidor (DIF)) from Banco Invest on ARKK made in 16/April/2020 (Portuguese language):

Source: Banco Invest ARKK - https://www.bancoinvest.pt/poupanca-e-investimento/titulos/etf/detalhe?simbolo=ARKK%20US&tipotitulo=ETF

This KID is a generic KID for all Banco Invest’s ETFs that don’t have KID (US-mainly ETFs):

O presente documento é genérico e aplica-se aos ETFs listados em bolsa e que não apresentam um Documento de Informação Fundamental individual.

About the investors:

Tipo de cliente não profissional ao qual se destina:
Cliente não profissional com conhecimentos e experiência avançados sobre as características e riscos associados a derivados, com o mais alto nível de tolerância ao risco e capacidade para suportar perdas que, em determinadas situações, podem exceder significativamente o montante investido.

English translation:

Type of non-professional client to whom it is intended:
Non-professional client with advanced knowledge and experience on the characteristics and risks associated with derivatives, with the highest level of risk tolerance and the ability to withstand losses that, in certain situations, may significantly exceed the amount invested.

The above text is a way that banks and brokers put the investment responsibility on the investors shoulders. :wink:

The people familiar with Degiro know how Degiro allows the investment in some types of financial instruments, just by asking a few simple questions about them.

If a small/medium Portuguese bank can do it, how difficult could it be? :wink:

As far as I am aware, these ETFs do not have KIIDs (your generic document does not count unfortunately) and so are unavailable to any retail clients in the EU. This is what people meant when they said not available in EU - there is no ā€œmythā€ here.

Saxo Bank does offer these, but in the EU unless you are designated a professional client, you cannot buy them (see screenshot of this warning on saxo platform)

For Saxo, one of the following requirements must be met in order to qualify as a professional client:

  • Have a financial portfolio that exceeds €500,000*
  • Have placed at least 10 relevant trades in significant sizes over the last four quarters
  • Work, or have worked, in the financial sector for at least one year

Would be good to get confirmation from someone in team212 like @David or @Rumen so all these repeated ARKK questions are finally put to bed, but as others have said before, current opinion is 212 cannot offer these.

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I know some Portuguese investors that bought ARK ETFs, common retail investors, that invested a few k in each ARK ETF, and they have done that on several Portuguese banks.

Portuguese financial markets regulator (CMVM) allows that type of KID. :wink:

There is some banks and brokers that allows the non-professional investors to access some financial instruments. E.g. Degiro asks a few questions. Others just ask the investor to tick a box, confirming that it’s the investor responsibility, and could be against the investor risk profile.

See my posts about that from here:

https://community.trading212.com/t/ark-innovation-etf-arkk-request/12297/105

In your image, even Saxo Bank says ā€œā€¦ in some jurisdictions.ā€

(ETFs are PRIIPs (KID))

Yeah that’s cool, but 212 isn’t in Portugal.

Point is ARK has been requested many times before, each time 212 team say cannot add without a KIID. FreeTrade is the same. HL is the same. AJ is the same.

Also as far as I can see, Degiro does not offer ARK products to retail investors, my account has every product allowed but still no ARK availability (if there is a way on Degiro to get this without being professional client pls show me!)

Anyway, hopefully David/Rumen will respond to my tag tomorrow morning with an answer.

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Also Inversis, a Spanish bank allow common retail investors to buy ARK ETFs, probably other European investment specialized banks also allow retail investors to invest on ARK ETFs.

Could it be a more strict FCA policy? See the recent Crypto-traded derivatives ban by the FCA.

The BTCE will be closed to retail investors on UK platforms, but it will also be closed on all other European countries?

Hi, I’m a bit of a simpleton but if I understand correctly from this thread…

Some of the Ark Etfs are on etorro. They are cfds with no overhead cost just a wider spread between bid and ask… you don’t own the asset which seems of small consequence to me.

It looks like ArkG genomics isn’t on etorro from the screenshot above. This is the one I wanted as it needs more specialist knowledge that Ark has and there could be big changes due to innovations…

I’m wondering if the restriction for having the ETFs is EU based and if there is a chance for this to change now we are not part of the EU. Wishful thinking maybe.

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Is quite of the opposite, there are several EU banks that sales the ARK ETFs to retail investors and apparently no UK bank does it.