as someone who full time trades in options they are options are very very very different to other instruments. Options will require its own dedicated and specialised interface to trade. If you introduce options as āone of your productā (like degiro does) it will be very little use. I keep pasting screenshots from tastyworks and you can probably tell it looks nothing like an āordinary trade interfaceā
4 Likes
Have you used Tastyworks to trade options? iāve been watching Tastyworks training videos https://tastytrade.thinkific.com/ which are very informative.
1 Like
Yes I have been exclusively using tastyworks for a few years for options.
If you have questions about the platform feel free to shoot and just for the shameless plug here is my referral link 
https://start.tastyworks.com/#/login?referralCode=DWJAS3BX27
1 Like
some screenshots on my previous post which should probably also underline the need for a completely different UI
ohhh i am about to flood your inbox as Option basics are still a head explosion for me haha
Random question, are Options tax free? i understand CFD was until April 2020, leaving only spread betting tax free.
Options are not tax free for UK investors.
1 Like
I am really interested to have the opportunity to trade options, there is an abundance of content out there to learn and to me some option strategies seem to be safer than CFD. I am not sure about how safer it is or what strategies can limit the loss effectively, but I would like to at least have options in practice mode and get to familiarize myself with them.
I am paying income tax on option profits.
They are eligible for CGT but it is not realistic to hold an option for a duration longer than 1year (except LEAPs) so income tax it is 
1 Like
But if you exercise the option, you can hold the underlying security for a year or longer right? 
(On a buy one say for stocks orā¦ 50 million barrels of oil, now where will I store it)
I am not sure about this one, I have never ever called an option, If everything goes well I hold them for less than 2 weeks usually.
1 Like
Sooo @David itās a maybe yeh? Need to beat free trade etc to it 
1 Like
I mean thatās fair enough if you just want to trade them, I was thinking of using them to potentially grab bargains by exercising them 
it could workā¦
Far be it for me to jump into this conversation so late but from what I understand CFDās are way riskier than Options, options effectively allow you to hedge your trades and reduce your principle size among other things which can shift a trade more in your favor
CFDās are basically instruments that allow people to take on margin, and usually way to much which is why most people who trade them looseā¦ and thatās about it
And sure Options trading is more complex that CFDās but stop me if Iām wrong but if a person cannot be bothered to take the time to learn and understand a tool then they frankly shouldnāt be investing there moneyā¦ they should put it in a bank account and leave it
4 Likes
you are right in that is a ātadā too late to jump in. so pardon if I donāt feel like re-entering the topic just to explain the same thing again with different words.
1 Like
typical Trading 212 user using options to āhedgeā
- I got 0.49 TSLA shares
- I am invested in Tesla way too much.
- Itād be detrimental for my overall portfolio if the share price goes more than 6% down.
- Let me buy 5% out of the money puts to cover my losses over 5% if it happens.
This does not sound real to me, soā¦ with all due respect, you are plain out wrong. Iāll have to agree with @Dao (also 1 option contract = 100 sharesā¦ so fractional options?!? 
)
Although āhedging your tradesā being one possible usage of options, this is the least effective way of defining them. No one but sizeable institution grade investors will be even using this approach.
On margin, your risk is amplified by yourā¦ margin (This involves any method of trading with pseudo borrowed money, including CFDs) 2 x Leverage you can loose 2x underlying asset. If the asset moves 3% your investment can move 6-7% depending on the spreads.
On options your risk is amplified by the movement you are buying/selling VS Implied volatility for that strike(delta and the rate of change on delta ā gamma) For example no one expects Coca Cola shares to do ājump movesā so it has very low IV. If you are holding a KO Call with an expiration in 2 weeks, and if the price of KO drops 3% tomorrow, it is highly likely that your investment will loose 80-90% for that 3% drop. Because at the end of the expiry you are either in the money or you got 0 (zero)
Just to over complicate things you also can trade options on margin which I highly recommend avoiding. Youāll need significant amount of holdings with a certain percentage liquid to even enable that.
Every day your investment in options will decay (theta) and you are loosing money, constantly unless the underlying asset price is moving towards the trade you made.
Yes it is slightly more complicated than simply buying and selling an instrument on margin, and yes of course you can educate yourself (and you should) but learning these does not make option trading less riskier. It is by far most volatile form of investing.
One saving grace is it looks scary enough to new users and they run away, before doing something senseless. On CFDs, users sees a share that is hyped enough and just hits buy.
Option trading is coming next year, itās one of the top 5/3 requested features. The team told me/us itās not in their plans for this year, because they clearly worked on other cool features like pies and adding new stocks and exchanges.
Next year I am super excited to get all features weāve been waiting for.
Talking here about the benefits of options over CFDs is useless, because T212 doesnāt offer them yet. Options are more sophisticated and complicated instruments by nature, CFDs are simple and offer the average Joe and also the pro to just go long and short synthetically without owning actual shares, hence readily available from most brokers.
People will not stop using CFDs and people will also not stop requesting/using options also, T212 will bring them and all other good things next year - they donāt want to and will not miss a feature that could be a deciding factor between them and another broker.
Until then, I advice everyone who is requesting options, to go the most requested features post (Most wanted features Survey (Reloaded)) and vote for options and wait till itās shipped!
8 Likes
this is so true, and a lot more useful than my āwall of textā 
I guess, I just get triggered when people pigeonhole options as āhedge instrumentsā
edit: ok for people asking for option trading resources, Iāve recommended this a few times but here it is again, Sasha (I am in no way affiliated with this guy) has a good coverage, starting from the very basics and fundamentals.
if you go to the options playlist, there are like 100 videos, ranging from 2 to 20 minutes. It starts from very basics like āwhat is an optionā ācall vs putā etc to, common strategies etc.
2 Likes
I guess, I just get triggered when people pigeonhole options as āhedge instrumentsā - It depends on your own goals, and how much money you have to put to work. and with respect if people are asking for the ability to do options trading unless your the guy in charge its not really up to you to tell people what to do with there moneyā¦ Although I do appreciate your inciteā¦
All this said personally I would stick to keeping trading 212 as an investment platformā¦ as far as trading goes Id used something like Tradestation, T212 isnāt really at the level you want for trades just yetā¦
I just googled Sasha Evdakov, with respect to the guy I cant see any details about his employment historyā¦ has he worked for an investment bank or a hedge fund? does he have a public trading record that is independently backed up? One of his books is about trading penny stocks with a TA strategy, who in there right mind would trade penny stocks??? your just begging to loose moneyā¦ yeaā¦ if you have any sense you will not follow this guyā¦
Iāve looked into equities and options trading coursesā¦ Best Iāve been able to find so far is this place (Iām not connected to them), much more focused on fundamentals and not on TA which in my opinion is what gets most traders into trouble and makes them focus on smaller time framesā¦
if your not interested then thatās fine but now on please try to avoided recommending trading courses ect from people who donāt actually have an professional experience trading
https://www.itpm.com/education/
1 Like
Sighā¦ this feels like high school debate team dejavu.
This precisely is my point, thanks for making it again. Options has 101 different uses, hedging is just one of them, Neither myself nor anyone else should pigeonhole how they are used. And first five lines of my post specifically emphasize this -low risk- is usage is highly unlikely in T212 user base although probable
The guy Iāve posted is a youtuber he is not an academic, nor a hedge managerā¦ The questions people ask and the ā2 minute videosā Iāve mentioned are on very basic things and fundamentals. As basic as āwhat is a call option?ā
1 Like
āSighā¦ this feels like high school debate team dejavu.ā ok listen you look like a teenager and saying things like that only makes you sound like one, I thanked you for your incite and instead of seeing that you replied back like a smart ass, no need for itā¦ And nothing youāve said is an actual argument against why the platform shouldnāt add options or why an adult with there own money should learn how to use it.
Regarding the Youtube vid you referenced, I make my point againā¦ if I wanted to know about a subject, I would consult people who have worked professionally in that areaā¦ people I dare say who have a provable track record. And as best I can gather this guy has none of that., I may as well listen to him give a talk on how to make a dining table from oak, his professional expertise as a wood worker are about as provable as his understand of trading and financial markets.
The trading and investment industry is packed full of charlatans and con artistsā¦ why would you refer people to watch videos by one of them?
Anywayā¦ back to the real world