In absence of Trading212 still not supporting these companies, which other platforms support these. The 212 team was looking to add these since last year.
I think the issue is they’re not present in the ISA, which is why he thinks the platform doesn’t have them. You can find them on the invest side, but they are not eligible for ISA accounts
Yes, I invest through the ISA account. I am able to buy BABA fine so what’s the eligibility criteria that prevents these from ISA (on Hargreaves I can see both the stocks ticked as eligible for Stocks & Shares ISA)
That’s strange. Maybe someone who hold/has held an ISA with HL should confirm.
@jdsouza UK Government guidance on the matter can be found here but it’s as clear as mud: Stocks and Shares investments for ISA managers - GOV.UK
I would hazard a guess that HL incorrectly lists TCEHY and BYDDY as Isa-eligible but I could be wrong; it doesn’t seem to let me place an order for the former in my Isa with them. @Finki, the resident expert on these things, has uncovered lots of similar errors with different brokers. As far as I can tell, Alibaba is something of an anomaly in that it is in fact eligible.
@Finki, o wise one, please would you be so kind as to enlighten us? Out of interest, if the OTC ADR (TCEHY) is ineligible, would it be the same story for the actual Hong Kong listing (0700)? HMRC appears to list the SEHK as a recognised stock exchange.
Ah ok, so they’re not in the ISA. Agree on the guidance, I think the underlying shares need to be registered on a recognised exchange to be ISA eligible.
If this logic is right, Tencent primary listing is HK, so could be ok -
Yeah, that’s what I thought with the underlying shares, which makes me think perhaps it is in fact Isa eligible. I wonder if T212 has just taken a blanket approach to all OTC stocks to avoid any mistakes as happened with Nio. Hopefully, the oracle of Finki.io can clarify.
Good point missed the US OTC part, dont think they are allowed.
TCEHY supports 0700. In the case of ADRs you always look towards the “parent”. In this instance the “Parent” is 0700 on HK. HK is a recognised exchange and 0700 is (now) Primarily Listed there (ie. not a fudge listing in HK, but a fully legit Listing). Therefore TCEHY is ISA’able because 0700 is ISA’able.
I have a feeling of De Ja Vu. I feel we discussed the Tencent/Alibaba/ various HK ADRs before.
Either way. The FinKi Auto ISA Machine says “Yes” to TCEHY as it says “Yes” to 0700. Because one guides the other.
OTC in pure isolation is a nonsense guide for ISA eligibility. If an asset is purely OTC and not traded anywhere else then no, it’s not ISA’able. If , like a lot of OTCs, they are simply quick and easy vehicles to trade an otherwise problematic asset to trade in the US, then you HAVE to look if they have a dual listing or a “parent” stock elsewhere. This is your primary variable in the “are they or aren’t they ISA eligble” question.
As always , the FinKi AUTO ISA API is here to help.
So if T212 are taking a “blanket” approach to OTC stocks… then they are wrong… or at least likely to be wrong in many cases
TCEHY and BYDDY are supported by Parent stocks fully listed in HK (despite the Incorporation status of PRC). HL are completely correct.
ISA eligibility is a moving target. People forget this. What was eligible yesterday may not be eligible today. It’s dynamic - especially when OTCs and ADRs are supported by “Parents”. If that “Parent” falls of a major exchange and becomes OTC… Ooop… suddenly the “child” is not Eligible. It’s dynamic. Very very few brokers understand this.
Thank you @Finki, it’s much appreciated, you’re a fountain of knowledge and I always learn lots from your posts. @David Any chance BYDDY and TCEHY could be made Isa-able please? Perhaps we could comb through some of the most popular OTC stocks to identify which ones are in fact eligible, so they can be added too?
Or better still just let us have access to the HKSE
Or someone with software made specifically for this could, ya know, ‘help’ 🤷🏼 Just sayin🤭
I have reached out to Trading212 twice and its come back with the following reply:
“I would like to follow up on your recent inquiry regarding the particular stocks traded on the OTC Market - BYD ticker $BYDDY and Tencent $TCEHY. Please note that as we have discussed in the chat, stocks traded on the OTC Market (ADRs) are not permitted to be held within the ISA accounts as per the HMRC’s regulations. The case was double-checked by the relevant department and I would like to confirm that the cited stocks will not be available for trading on our ISA accounts.”