@Vedran , even if it comes as premium, would be great.
@VicVega would be great if each investor can choose the best option. I really like T212, and for a āfreeā app, is very good. If I have account in BGP, and 50% of my trades/investment is in USD, for me doesnāt make sense to do it throught T212.
I agree it may not be possible in an ISA account.
That s why is important to know the T212 plans on this matter.
@pintas Iām in the same boat, however 85% of my trades are in USD, which means I pay fx fee for almost every trade. 0.15% is an amount I would happily pay in exchange of having my pies organised any day!
However, If your investing style is different in a way that the 0.15% fx on 50% of your trades does not make sense, I wouldnāt count on the chance T212 implementing multicurrency accounts. Thatās my opinion.
I hope people realise we are talking about 0.15%. Take the bigger picture and some other brokers charge monthly fees, platform fees and so on.
I am a long term investor so a 0.15% fee added to foreign trades is fine in comparison to paying 9.99 a month (80k balance), Or a 0.25% plus platform fee and £10 a trade.
What I would share if there was out there was a comparison table between brokers but Indont think there is one. It would need to capture 6 different scenarios to be useful to everyone. A small/medium/large net account worth, and a long term/day trader.
For me, it is not about fee, but mostly for fx hedge.
They can still get the fees when you exchange money.
Exactly the same principle e.g. as Revolut. If I donāt care about exchange rate, I get current rate when I pay something. If there is good exchange rate, e.g.weak usd I can load up a lot of money upfront and then spend later in usd.
So there still can be your āmainā account where you can deposit / withdraw money and āsub accountsā where you can only trade with money you have exchanged with fee.
Sure, they will make a little less money as you will pay only on deposit and withdrawal to/from sub account and not on every sell / buy operations, but it still not be free and generate income.
It wonāt be āa little less moneyā, as you have 1 FX conversion in deposit and another 1 on withdrawal, instead of regular or even daily FX conversions when you buy or sell securities denominated on foreign currency.
For the sake of simplicity, the FX rate is 1:1, there is no bid-ask spread and ignoring profit/loss of the transactions.
Scenario 1 - Multicurrency accounts:
1k GBP/EUR transferred and converted from their account to USD account
FX Fees = 1.5 GBP/EUR
Transaction 1
Buy 1k USD stock ā FX Fees = 0
Sell 1k USD stock ā FX Fees = 0 (admitting no profit/loss)
Transaction 2-xxxx
Still no FX Fees on buy and sell on infinite number of transactions made.
1k USD transferred and converted from their account to GBP/EUR account (admitting no profit/loss)
FX Fees = 1.5 GBP/EUR
TOTAL FX FEES = 3 GBP/EUR
Scenario 2 - No multicurrency accounts:
Transaction 1
Buy 1k USD stock ā FX Fees = 1.5 GBP/EUR
Sell 1k USD stock ā FX Fees = 1.5 GBP/EUR (admitting no profit/loss)
Transaction 2-xxxx
Buy 1k USD stock ā FX Fees = 1.5 GBP/EUR ā ā EACH TRANSACTION
Sell 1k USD stock ā FX Fees = 1.5 GBP/EUR (admitting no profit/loss) ā ā EACH TRANSACTION
TOTAL FX FEES = 3 GBP/EUR x (each buy/sell transactions)
Bottom-line: It takes only 1 more transaction in a non multicurrency accounts scenario to T212 to make more money in FX Fees. Now multiply that by the number of transactions made and the number of investors who made them, to see that the FX fees could escalate easily. And not taking into account the profits/losses of the transactions that increase/decrease the FX Fees.
I know how it works. Again, if somebody trades with those conditionsā¦
As long term investor, have 0 sells since I have T212 account so far Iām paying only fee on buy and will pay 1fx fee when I will want to close positions (10 years) or 3000% meme stock hype
If there will be some increase of fx fee (or introduction of other fees) I will stop using T212 completely. With card fee it is already on the edge now (so I am not using card deposit anymore), for some buys I am using other brokers already. They are getting cheaper and starting to be ācommission freeā, T212 quite opposite.
@rancans
the introduction of the FX fee is T212ās response to the subject of multi-currency accounts. that response being āitās not currently in the plansā for the near future. likely because the feeās collected go a good way to improving the service we receive, which include the much larger support base and more stable servers.
if the FX Fee is a deal breaker for you, then you have alternatives to use, some people before have suggested IBKR perhaps? though I have also heard their customer support can be almost non-existent for some. at least we can request T212 to add new instruments and features, IBKR just outright ignores their clients.
post from February but no post since to indicate a change in position.
you canāt avoid something with a mechanism that doesnāt exist. you canāt even change your accounts base currency currently, so how do you propose multiple currencies be handled?
Also bank transfers are not free for everyone, they differ by country and the bank you hold an account with. It there were a free option do you think Obrien would have willingly spent 300EUR funding their account last year?
Multiple times in the history we have seen that went a currency falls in value the stock market tends to perform well as the shares looking more cheap to international investors. So being able to buy a currency then and invest on another time is for sure a plus for a platform.
sometimes we get lucky with a double green, sometimes gouged by a double red. but in flat markets seeing the green and red negate each other can be either a blessing or a disappointment.
Most of my investments are US stocks, so I see this fluctuation frequently, still managed a decent ~20% return for the majority of the last 2 years despite the tiny FX feeās eating away at some of my transactions. penny pinching works great for savings, but for investments I prefer to not pick at pennies when there are pounds to be made.
In the comments below an article in yesterdayās Sunday Times Money section, āWhat became of the armchair share traders?ā, readers expressed a lot of criticism of the large currency exchange fees charged by the three leading UK platforms. The Sunday Times article reads as a puff piece for the big platforms. As one commentator wrote:
āWhy donāt you write something on the FX fees that these companies charge? They charge up to 1.5%. Not only is this well above the market rate of maybe 0.02%, the companies donāt pay this. They are not passing on a charge that they as brokers pay. Instead they internalise the transactions. This is one of their biggest profit centres as acknowledged by one of IIās private backers.ā
Trading 212ās 0.15% does compare favourably with the UK big three.
I have the same fee per trade with my domestic broker which does offer multicurrency accounts so I have just skipped the hassle and returned back to them with new money to be invested. They set a minimum fee as well but nowadays I donāt do small trades so that does not hurt me. Money transfer there and back is instantaneous and without fees so there is nothing for me in continuing the use of trading212.