I appreciate that if you open an account with Vanguard there is a fee i.e. 0.05% admin fees per annum.
However, what is the score with buying into a Vanguard ETF on 212. is there a charge each year? I have had an account more than year and havent seen anything yet. I assume the fee is taking some other way.
I use Vanguard as an example, im sure iShares or WisdomTree charge fees directly or via other platforms
Sorry if a silly question!
Itâs not a silly question at all. Think off the phrase âyou donât know what you donât knowâ.
The financial markets and regulators, although they try to be transparent, are unnecessarily complicated and can provide too much detail it can become confusing even for those in the industry.
To try and simplify it, you can get open or closed end funds that pool investors money for a small fee with a view of reducing costs and providing a better return for investors.
212 have a number of Vanguard ETFs. These are exchange traded funds. These are open ended, which means there is no limit of supply.
If the ETF holds 100 companies at an equal weight, so if you invest ÂŁ100 in the ETF, it will invest ÂŁ1 into 100 companies. It all depends on the âETFâ strategy.
Back to your question, there is a charge for Vanguard running the ETF. This will include Vanguardâs fee, plus regulatory fees for say marketing the ETF in France/Germany/UK and so on. The ETF will also be audited once a year, and will produce regular reports of its performance and holdings.
The costs for these, all inclusive are called an âOngoing Chargeâ. This is essentially baked in or included in the value of the shares you buy.
This is a popular Vanguard ETF - VWRP
Itâs fees are 0.22% a year, and baked into it ts NAV/price.
Then you get platform and trading fees. How much does it cost you to hold or buy this ETF.
Trading212 do not charge you a platform fee(for holding this ETF), nor do they charge you a trading fee, unless your account is in a different currency, in which case it would be a 0.15% FX fee, but you could find an ETF in your own currency.
For comparison, Fidelity or Hargreaves would charge you approx ÂŁ10 every time you trade, and a 0.35%-0.45% account fee on top.
Does this help explain / make sense?
Also - I think the Vanguard platform fee is 0.25% but not checked it in a while.
The T212 platform doesnât show ETF fees so you could say they are âhiddenâ People surely buy without being aware. I think they should add the fee under instrument details. Or better in the search results somewhere so you sort by fees.
I think it would be a helpful piece of information to have in the system for new investors, and just general ease.
With that being said, I would hope people would be a bit responsible and look into what theyâre buying and investigate the associated fees. I couldnât imagine not looking into that prior to pushing the button on an IT or ETF.
Itâs always also worth checking what builds up the ETF or IT, geographically, companies, weightingâs etc etc.
Itâs actually 0.15% for the ISA account, thatâs where Iâll be heading next year.
With my previous broker before you bought an ETF it had a warning checkbox you had to check to say you accept that there are fees and you have read the key investor doc. Now I think about it the FCA might be interested in a company selling ETFs to people without providing them with all info before they buy. Maybe someone else knows the law on that.
Iâm sure theyâve looked into the legality side, without being too presumptuous.
We should be dealing with adults here that can think a little bit for themselves.
It kind of goes back to having some form of test prior to allowing trading in real cash. But if 212 donât need to do that, they probably wonât as itâll impact revenue etc.
Sure I know what you mean. Itâs obvious to most of us. Maybe at least a one liner before you buy to say there are fees something simple is all thatâs needed to cover themselves from regulation
Edit. T212 have been in trouble for other things like putting NIO in an ISA so I wouldnât assume they have looked into it.
Good point. So if you want access to the full range, itâs cheaper for OEICs than most other platforms up to a balance of about 80k. At which point the II ÂŁ10 a month works out better, and then gives more variety.
If just ETFs, could stick with 212 as 0.15% cheaper 
0.15 % for the SIPP, and I think any type of account.
Youâre very limited with the funds you can pick thoughâŚI know they only offer Vanguard products but even within these itâs very limited in the SIPP. For example thereâs no VWRP but there is VWRL.
I just feel a bit more secure elsewhere to be honest, it might be me just being paranoid though
Good spot! I need to check into that as itâll be one of the ETFs Iâd be in
A lot of my ETFâs are Vanguard and the fees are clearly written on the overview page of the website 0.07% / 0.09% this gets taken out during purchases (if Iâm right?)
For me itâs not nor would it be very noticeable considering itâs a low % and a % Iâm happy to pay as I personally like vanguard funds.
212 donât have any other charges which is why Iâm happy investing EFTâs through them. Itâs always easy / stress free.
(Unlike some AIM stocks but we wonât go there now!)
You just need to work out what youâre investing and check the OFC and go from there.
Someone tell me if Iâve learnt that all wrong?
Iâm not sure if itâs SIPP specific but they seem to be favouring distribution over accumulation funds. Iâd considered buying VWRP in my 212 isa but the tax savings from the SIPP swayed my decision. Just need to remember to do an annual âspring cleanâ and invest the dividends!
Hey, everyone 
, do excuse me for jumping in like that, but I thought you might find this useful.
Any external fees and charges, concerning the instruments on the platform, can be found, if you :
Once youâve opened the document, youâll be able to see everything in detail. Hope that helps!
Both FCA regulated and all that would be my view so should have the same protection if all goes Pete TongâŚ
@B.E Cheers for the link, but some of the KIIDS are out of date. This one is 5 months:
Sorry to point it out
I donât think there is a simple/easy single repository out there to point the link to that would auto update. Would make things much simpler!
Itâs no different to your dividends received in an etf, they are included into the share price? Surely this is basic stuff for a stand alone investor?
In EU countries, the banks and brokers have the KID/KIID/prospects of the funds (mutual/investment funds, ETFs), ETNs, ETCs, bonds, IPOs, due to legal obligations.
Some banks and brokers have a Morningstar integration in their platform, also to provide the legal documentation. That why I also suggested T212 to have a Morningstar integration in their platform.
The companies (stocks) also have expenses during their activity, and people look for financial statements to see if they meet their investment expectations.
People have their own obligations, itâs their money, at least they should do some due diligence, They arenât mindless persons or little children that must be given all the information they need without any effort.
It depends if youâre in a distributing ETF or not.
For instance with VUSA etc you get issued quarterly dividends.
Totally agree with you here.
Surely your fees would be taken from the dividends then? Iâve not come across that but then I donât have a lot of different etfs as they usually cross paths