I will explain:
Example:
Actual GBP/EUR: 1.1650/1.1660. (Sell/Buy. Or Bid/Ask).
If you buy 1 item with Chase they will do:
Mid-Market (1.1650+1.166)/2 = 1.1655 minus 0.35% = Efective FX exchange value = 1,16142075
Trading 212 will do:
Interbank 1.1650 minus 0.15% = Efective FX exchange value = 1.1632525
On this example “IN THEORY” Trading 212 gives a better effective FX rate due the lower Fee.
But after applying the Cashback, things change 
Sorry to say this mate but you are wrong if you think that Interbank and Mid-Market are the same.
You can read my examples and explanation above. Also, you can google it if you don’t believe me and see the difference. Mid-market value is better than Interbank from the customer’s point of view.
Even Trading 212 admits it is different on their webpage. Have a look.
Someone already corrected me on the mid market rate and i said further up i was incorrect.
I was reading from wise
thats where i understood it.
However your calculations for chase is wrong (i think haha)
Chase uses the mastercard rate (you said its the midmarket rate) and is fee free
trading212 looks right though. Interbank + 0.15% on top.
the table someone linked above is the estimated markup from interbank rate i believe.
Crabbycrabcrab:
No, Mastercard uses Mid-market with a markup or fee, that goes up to 0,35% (in my experience it has been going from 0,25% to 0,35% on different purchases at different times of the day).
Also in another post above I proofed from the own Mastercard webpage that their live rate corresponds to the Actual Mid-market value plus the mentioned markup of 0,25-0,35%. Please have a look. I think my example makes sense and it’s all right. Let me know where you see any mistakes or why you disagree
Mid-Market value is the middle value,
In my example, I wrote:
(1.1650+1.166)/2 = 1.1655
And later applied the 0,35% markup or fee
That gives the effective FX rate for Chase. 》
= 1,16142075
Where do you see any mistakes?
Im not sold on the markup fee from mastercard. I cant find anything online about it or it using the midmarket.
Come across these articles though!
Also very confusing stuff haha.
But if your maths is right and you done the testing. Great!
Whats the end verdict.
Chase is best, then Trading212 then revolut?
The table is right except for the fact that Mastercard uses Mid-market (favourable) and Trading 212 Interbank value. It does change from different forex coins but usually Interbank value is between 0.05% and 0.10% more expensive than Mid-market for the customer.
But since the Trading 212 fee is 0.20% lower than Mastercard (used by Chase), gives an effective FX rate for withdraws better with Trading 212. (Unles the interbank Bid/Ask gets wider under volatility scenarios).
If you can not find the official Mastercard markup FX fee published, optionally you can open the Mastercard official live rate value (that includes the fee) (Mastercard calculator) and compare the value with the Mid-market (you can find it for example at investing.com) All real-time values.
Verdict: (at least in Europe in the case of GBP/EUR)
For ATM € withdrawals: wins Trading 212
For purchase with card: wins Chase ( due to the higher cashback that overcompensates the Fee difference. )
But as someone said, if you use Chase in 1 month for purchases over 1.500£, then you should use Trading 212 afterwards (due to the Chase limits on cashback up to 15£)
From the link you posted, I found this:
That matches with my experience that Mastercard FX rate often is less than 0,35%
I was using the 0,35% because is the value that Trading 212 uses on its own webpage comparison table.
So, it’s probable often Mastercard FX rate is even better than in my examples above.
I would like to test it one day, buying the same item 2 times at the same time and using Chase and Trading 212 card.
@Verde as others have explained above, Interbank and mid market are practically the same in major currency pairs
Goes down to don’t believe everything you read without checking the facts yourself.
No, they’re not. Just go to https://www.trading212.com/cards and scroll down.
Ok Grims they’re not 100% the same but generally used interchangeably in the industry.
Interbank for currency pairs involving major developed currencies generally only have a few bp in the spread, hence both terms are mixed.
There’s not a clear all round winner for retail FX - it depends on the currency pair or time of day which FX mechanism you should use to minimise fees. There are times 212 will be better for GBP/EUR and times worse when compared to using your banks Mastercard/Visa rate. All much better than the currency exchanges you generally get in say an airport.
Interbank includes spread, so buy and sell prices are different, while mid-market is average of those. Same rate (possibly slighly different, based on FX provider), different position. I agree that the spread is usually low and that the terms are often being mixed.
Different services also mix the nomenclature on purpose and call their rate the “true” rate etc., being mysterious on purpose. Some of them, i.e. Wire, claim to use mid-market, but compensate with higher fees. Others have lower fees, which looks good on paper, but use interbank rate, including the spread, acting as invisible fee. T212 is quite transparent in this matter, which I like. My point is that only real-life tests are reliable source for any valid comparison.
In any case, interbank without any markup +0,15% will be better in 99% of cases than Mastercard, and in 100% than Visa, more so for more exotic currencies.
Has anyone received their physical card yet?
I must clarify that the Mid-Market rate and Interbank rate are not the same, despite their similarity. Although major currency pairs have a small bid/ask spread, the difference between the two rates can be significant. It’s akin to selling a house for £200,000 versus £199,999, or comparing an orange to a big mandarin.
While the two rates almost converge, they are not the same. It’s important to verify information yourself rather than relying entirely on what you read. Having traded major and minor currency pairs for nearly a decade, I can attest to the potential for a spread of up to 1%, which can result in losses if not taken into account.
So NO, Mid-Market is NOT the same as the Interbank rate, even in the best ideal scenario that often is the pair EUR/USD which has the biggest liquidity and smaller spread of all the pairs.
If you have knowledge about Forex, spread, liquidity, bid/ask, and arbitration, then you would know that Interbank rate is always equal to or worse than Mid-Market rate. Therefore, Mid-Market rate is always the best option for customers.
However, there can be a discussion when MasterCard uses the previous day’s close value instead of the live rate, whereas Trading 212 may use different timelines like close of the day, live rate, or hourly value. In such cases, there may be occasions where one rate becomes better than the other.
I do agree with all except the last paragraph. Sometimes the MasterCard Mid-Market plus markup (~ found out to be 0,25% instead of 0,35%) can beat the InterBank + 0,15%.
Also a few posts above there is a very interesting study of the daily official rates (including FX markup) of Interbank versus MasterCard versus Visa.
Out of the literature, on my real-life experience with Chase MasterCard with purchases in Euro, I found out the MasterCard Mid-Market plus markup value it’s often in the range of 0,20-0,30% from Mid-Market.
The average Bid/asK in GBPEUR is 0,02-0,05% or 2 to 5 pips. Sometimes it can go low to 1 pip or 10 on higher volatility events.
I’ve received mine a few days ago. It shipped from Germany.
Have only tried using it once so far in the UK and was unable to complete the transaction. Not sure if this is due to the choice of location or because I tried to make a contactless payment without using my PIN.
@MarcoL, when you select a particular transaction and open the detailed view, the exact exchange rate for the transaction and the FX fee will all be listed there.
@random53, Since you’re using the card for the first time, you must insert it into the merchant’s POS terminal and enter your PIN. A chip and PIN transaction is always required when using the card for the first time.
On a side note, there might be several other reasons why the payment was declined. For example, there might be a merchant processing error.
Hi @Bogi.H. T212 card still shows as a business card on Curve for me and every transaction I have attempted to make on Curve via PayPal results in being declined by T212
Hi @Dosm, Our cards are personal. I’ve sent you a direct message to verify what appears on your end.
